Matrix Reloaded...spoiler...

Post by **mid_gen** » Thu May 22, 2003 10:52 am

I'm warning you, if you haven't seen it yet you'll be pissed off if you scroll down

So, to people who have seen it

I gather the gist of the film is that the entire of the first film took place wholly inside the matrix, with 'Psion' and plugging/unplugging themselves from the matrix was just another part of the illusion, hence Neo zaps the sentinels at the end....

Moo

The Neo vs the smiths fight kicks ass, who ever would have thought anyone as wet as keanu reeves would do it =/

Top film anyway

God knows what happens in the next one.

shrek · Post by **shrek** » Thu May 22, 2003 5:43 pm

Top film anyway God knows what happens in the next one.

Did u not see the trailer at the end for the next one?

Post by **mid_gen** » Thu May 22, 2003 5:47 pm

Nah, I didn't know about it =/

I've also been told that what I thought happened in the film is wrong. Supposedly Neo twats the sentinels at the end because he's got a bit of Agt Smith in him, not because he's actually still in the matrix...

Sounds a bit flaky to me...but Enter The Matrix is supposed to explain it, so I am currently abusing Game's 10-day returns policy to find out

shrek · Post by **shrek** » Thu May 22, 2003 5:54 pm

To get to the trailer u had so sit through all the credits first, only problem is that the credits are ten minutes long =/

Also If Neo was in the matrix when he twated the sentinels it wouldn't of nearly killed him, meaning he done that in the real world...As for Agt Smith I think hes got a bit of Neo in him hence why he can clone him self now and Neo got a bit of Smith in him, this all happened in the hallway at the end of the first film...

dogmeat · Post by **dogmeat** » Fri May 23, 2003 1:21 am

It's no abuse of the service, it's to let gamers like us see whether games are any good. Or finish them then take 'em back.

ZiK · Post by **ZiK** » Fri May 23, 2003 3:16 am

anyway, back onto the matrix

clearly one of the best films this year! i cannot wait for revolutions!

Post by **mid_gen** » Fri May 23, 2003 10:33 am

shrek wrote:To get to the trailer u had so sit through all the credits first, only problem is that the credits are ten minutes long =/

Also If Neo was in the matrix when he twated the sentinels it wouldn't of nearly killed him, meaning he done that in the real world...As for Agt Smith I think hes got a bit of Neo in him hence why he can clone him self now and Neo got a bit of Smith in him, this all happened in the hallway at the end of the first film...

True, but you don't see agent smith zapping anything in the first film. In fact, since he is just a program in teh matrix, how can he do *anything* outside of the matrix? In the hallway you just saw Agt Smith explode...nothing is explained.

shrek · Post by **shrek** » Sat May 24, 2003 10:57 am

True smith can't do anything outside teh matrix as he's a program, but in the matrix he can clone himself now, which he of gained after being set free from being a agent by neo in the first film in the hallway.

ZiK · Post by **ZiK** » Sat May 24, 2003 10:58 am

so, seeing as Neo has a part of smith in him, do you think that neo will be able to clone himself?

shrek · Post by **shrek** » Sat May 24, 2003 11:01 am

Hmm doubt it, I think all that neo gained was being able to sense the sentinals now and being able to twat them outside the matrix but nearly killing himself in the process.

Chief · Post by **Chief** » Sat May 24, 2003 7:36 pm

<architect> "This will be the 6th time we have destroyed xion and we are becomming exceedling effecient at it"

man. this line sells the whole "still inside the matrix" to me.

ie: there are now 3 layers to it, the 1st matrix: current day where all the kung fu goes on.. 2nd matrix: where all the sentinels and xion exists... 3rd layer is the real world where somehow everything is happening ??

this 3rd layer i think will be revealed in some way..
agent smith. smithy, or "jesus christ" as some of the internet enabled cristians may put it... shouldnt be able to exist inside someones head in the real world - its a piece of software... again sellin the whole 2 layers to the matrix thing.

in any case, the thrid film will be a smash and any reviewers who have slated the 2nd film should be hung from he nearest lamp post for their sheer stupidty and obvious dis-interest in anything sci-fi .

Spey · Post by **Spey** » Sat May 24, 2003 8:45 pm

i think the "real world" really is the real world and isnt a trick within the matrix

the previous 5 "ones" have so far worked according to the plan of the machines and lead to the destruction of zion. inside the matrix neo although all powerful is really powerless to stop the machines, he effectivley "beat" the matrix and reached the architecht, at this point he was expected to conclude the current matrix (6th one) and start the 7th. no matter what choice he made it would result in the destruction of zion.
on the one hand he can start the 7th matrix and free the first few to construct a new zion killing everyone in the matrix, or leave the current matrix to run and sentence all those in the real world to die. thus far the previous "ones" had restarted the matrix and set free those to build zion

neo chose the other option, and has hence come to realise the entire prophecy of "the one" is all part of the system and he is basically a pawn

i beleive in the next film you will see why he truly is "the one" (if you can use that term) as in both films to date he has demonstrated power outside of the matrix (bringing himself back to life in the first, and killing the sents in the second)

there must be less than 10 survivors outside of the matrix now with zions destruction, and with the revelation that his powers within the matrix alone cannot save the human race he is going to have to pull something pretty spectacular out of the bag

should be action packed whatever the case

ps i dont think the architecht referring to the efficiency at destrying zion means its in the matrix i think when he says "we" he means the machines rather than programs in the matrix

and as for smith i dont think he and neo have fused, smith has however developed feeling, which in the first film as he started to develop it he spoke about how he despised it in the scene before the helicopter rescue

i think neos intervention and the resulting blowing up of smith has somehow made the matrix decide it no longer needs smith and due to it now trying to delete him he has developed a bit of a grudge and the ability to duplicate himself (not sure how, even smith himself is unclear as to what happened, 3rd film shed some light on this maybe?)

Ironballs · Post by **Ironballs** » Sat May 24, 2003 9:30 pm

Am I the only one worried about inbreeding in Zion ?

From the first film we know that 100 years ago "the one" freed the first people and takes them to zion and then dies and they go looking for him and find Neo. Then he picks 16 males and 17 females to join him in the next version. So if we follow on the logic of him keep picking the same decisions like deciding to let zion be crushed would that also make him keep picking the same people every time ? Looks to me like 6 sets of 100 years worth of rebreeding from the same gene pool

someone explain why they don't all have webbed feet please

bartender · Post by **bartender** » Sun May 25, 2003 1:47 am

there must be less than 10 survivors outside of the matrix now with zions destruction, and with the revelation that his powers within the matrix alone cannot save the human race he is going to have to pull something pretty spectacular out of the bag

I don't believe that Zion was destroyed as if you watch the preview trailer at the end of the film for Matrix Revolutions you see scenes where Zion is being attacked by the sentinels. When they refer to the massacre by the machines I can only assume that they are referring to only the ships that where sent to intercept the machines on their way down.

I've heard that Enter the Matrix has some answers hasn't anyone completed it yet and could let us in on the secret????

garlando · Post by **garlando** » Sun May 25, 2003 7:52 am

Ironballs wrote:Am I the only one worried about inbreeding in Zion ?

From the first film we know that 100 years ago "the one" freed the first people and takes them to zion and then dies and they go looking for him and find Neo. Then he picks 16 males and 17 females to join him in the next version. So if we follow on the logic of him keep picking the same decisions like deciding to let zion be crushed would that also make him keep picking the same people every time ? Looks to me like 6 sets of 100 years worth of rebreeding from the same gene pool

someone explain why they don't all have webbed feet please

But as they said they keep freeing new peeps in fact "in the last six months we have freed more people than in the past six years" so they are gettting new peeps into the gene pool

Chief · Post by **Chief** » Sun May 25, 2003 8:46 am

Spey wrote:]
and the ability to duplicate himself (not sure how

thats simple, a call to this method will copy any program to the target program and overwrite it:

Code: Select all

public class copy &#40;host, target&#41;

spey, i dont see how a handfull of survivors or people who are set free can possibly build a city from scratch like that and hold off the machines with no defences?

its either a city which is virtual, or...
a city which has existed since before the first matrix which was built by man to defend against the machines.
but as the matrix is really serveral hundered or a thousand years old then people only believeing its been 100 years means that the inhabitants think the war is still 100 years old etc...

so, after seeing zion, who thinks a handfull of survivors could build a thing like that ? even after 100 years?[/code]

LazyManc · Post by **LazyManc** » Sun May 25, 2003 11:29 pm

From what I saw (and was backed up by the trailer for the 3rd film) the sentinel attack was on the humans preparing the counter attack on the machines and not on Zion itself, hence neo's "we've got 24 hours to do somethng or were fucked" line shortly after saving Trinity (not quite in those words, I cant remember them exactly, but you get the idea).

As for Agt Smith taking over a human mind and existing in the real world, I think that's possible, afterall whats a brain except for a few electronic pathways and switches? You've all read Snow Crash surely?

The choice the architect gave was:

Left door - war continues, results in destruction of the matrix and/or the death of whole human race, Trinity's unavoidable death (which was avoided).

Right door - the one (neo) re-enters the source, *reloads* the matrix (for 7th time??), rebuild zion with a couple of dozen new people, rebalances the system

I'm still puzzling the whole
(Real World, real human battery farm, real machines (Zion, Nebecaneza, Neo, battery farm simulation, sentinels (Matrix) ) )
thing... but how can you ever be sure you are out of the matrix?? From what the architect was saying it certainly sounds like Zion (and everything supposedly outside of the matrix) is a catch all program for Human minds which are unsettled in the true matrix and feel the need to rebel.

So if they're all still in the matrix, and Zion is just a way for the humans to think they're rebelling every so often, and the one (currently neo) is like a release valve that rebalances the system...? but that means that the 3rd film contains the destruction of either Zion or the machines (which arent really the machines but simulations of machines) ??

Or it could just be something the architect made up in deseperation to put Neo off the track and they really are in the real world... who knows.

It would be really lame if they finished it off with a Men in Black style zoom out (universe in a marble) that showed the *real* real world (this is getting silly) running on someones PC screensaver or crap like that.

Anyway, the only thing we can be sure of at this point is that Zion is still alive and kicking, whether it be a real place or a virtual one.

Sorry for the rambling nature of this post, my brain is still tying itself in knots.

Ironballs · Post by **Ironballs** » Mon May 26, 2003 11:51 am

Would be a bit of a rip off of ExistenZ if they did that too.

BoredAtWork · Post by **BoredAtWork** » Tue May 27, 2003 9:28 am

I've finished the game and unless I've forgotten there is only really one point in which it sheds more light on this issue. After whatever mission Niobe is just about to pick up the phone and "get out" when this weird bloke (we'll call him Pete) walks past saying

Pete "72 hours"
Niobe "what"
Pete "72 hours, thats how long Zion lasted last time"
Niobe "Who are you?"
Pete "Just a passenger along for the ride" - Mad laugh

(Or something close to that)

Anyway that is the only bit in the game that really addresses the Matrix/Real World thing. The rest of the game simply expands on Reloaded so the film makes more sense when you see it or vice versa I guess.

Personally I think that they are all still in the Matrix and always have been. In the film the architect talks about how 99% of people would accept the Matrix if they were given a choice. Seems to me the whole Reistance/Zion/Real World is simply something built to fool the 1% who don't accept that the Matrix. Wow I'm confused now.....