Happy New Year!!!!!

Post by **mid_gen** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 7:05 pm

Applying a stereotype to a whole nation is always going to be innacurate, but at the moment they have a man in power who is determined to initiate military action in Iraq and probably North Korea. Bad news...

Doesn't mean Americans are bad tho.

eclipse · Post by **eclipse** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 7:07 pm

Seahorse wrote:If they were serious about anti-terrorism they would be warming up to do N Korea with its nuclear programme, not Iraq. There's no oil in N Korea, anyone see a connection...

I always thought the american government was corrupt.

Post by **Kulgan** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 7:08 pm

Iraq they can take. But North Korea's gonna be a hard slog - they've got some bloody serious hardware in there. Especially as they and the South Koreans have been eyeing each other over the border for decades...

K

Sharpe · Post by **Sharpe** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 7:08 pm

the koreans wont drop the bom on the people next to them, thats just stupid they will take them selvs out aswell which is so silly

Post by **mid_gen** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 7:09 pm

Umm, nukes are pretty nasty, but not *that* nasty. They've come a long way since 1945..

eclipse · Post by **eclipse** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 7:10 pm

Korea's pretty cool when it comes to technology and computers and things I find, I was listening to a programme on the radio about it in the wee hours of teh morning. pretty interesting it was.

Seahorse · Post by **Seahorse** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 7:21 pm

Won't been if the N Koreans and bombing it...

biggles · Post by **biggles** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 7:27 pm

zalman flowers are made in korea

Seahorse · Post by **Seahorse** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 7:30 pm

Kiss them goodbye then...

biggles · Post by **biggles** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 7:32 pm

mmm, mine will be a superheated relic, mwahahahahahha

LazyManc · Post by **LazyManc** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 9:16 pm

IMO the americans should just stay the fuck away, they poked their noses in on vietnam and look where that got them. Iraq might not be as harsh a terrain to fight a landwar on, but they're gonna have exactly the same problems they did distiguishing between who's civilian and who's gonna shoot you in the head the minute your back is turned if and when they ever get to Baghdad. It's just gonna stir up a shitload of hatred and racism.

Same goes for N. Korea, they've got the 4th largest army in the world, without even starting on the nukes.

Umm, nukes are pretty nasty, but not *that* nasty. They've come a long way since 1945..

Maybe here, Russia and in the States they have, but a Korean built nuke will be much less sophisticated, probably on par with what the yanks had back in the 60's, so you never know whats gonna happen. I think with N. Korea the best bet is the threat of retaliation, it worked (just about) with the Ruskies for the most part.

Is N. Korea having nukes a good idea? No, but the fact is, the US just doesn't have the right to tell or enforce non-developement.

Seahorse · Post by **Seahorse** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 9:25 pm

I take it you have not heard of the Non Proliferation Treaty (NPT). The NPT is the most widely accepted arms control agreement in the world. As of early 2000 a total of 187 states were Parties to the NPT. Cuba, Israel, India, and Pakistan were the only states that were not members of the NPT.

In 1994, the United States and North Korea signed an "Agreed Framework" bringing North Korea into full compliance with its non-proliferation obligations under the NPT. North Korea affirmed its NPT member status and committed to allow implementation of its IAEA safeguards agreement.

Therefore N Korea should NOT be developing Nukes.

Dammit, kids these days just don't bother to read anything...

LazyManc · Post by **LazyManc** » Thu Jan 02, 2003 9:34 pm

I had heard about the NPT but I was under the assumption that N. Korea wasn't part of it. Ok, so they're lying bastards, but what does the treaty say about those who break it?

Seahorse · Post by **Seahorse** » Fri Jan 03, 2003 9:31 am

Good question. The text of the NPT is written in semi-legal jargon (Diplomat Speak

) and as far as my non-legal/diplomatic brain can see, Article X states:

1. Each Party shall in exercising its national sovereignty have the right to withdraw from the Treaty if it decides that extraordinary events, related to the subject matter of this Treaty, have jeopardized the supreme interests of its country. It shall give notice of such withdrawal to all other Parties to the Treaty and to the United Nations Security Council three months in advance. Such notice shall include a statement of the extraordinary events it regards as having jeopardized its supreme interests.

Their supreme interests have not been affected IMHO. There is no punishment clause and N Korea is a member of the UN, which means they are in contradiction of the agreements that they have signed up to in the first place.

I also notice that they are in violation of the 1953 UN Resolution that ended the Korean War, as the North Korean army has placed light machine guns into the Demilitarized Zone.

Safe to say that they are a tin pot dictatorship, happily starving their own countrymen to death and putting two fingers up to world opinion. Surely exactly the kind of place that the UN was set up to stop...

Chief · Post by **Chief** » Fri Jan 03, 2003 11:21 am

the UN are pussies..
needs some good old MI6 Involvement

LazyManc · Post by **LazyManc** » Fri Jan 03, 2003 1:33 pm

I'm not in support of N. Korea in any way, but how many lives is it worth to make sure they know who's boss? If they invade or attack another country then it's a different matter, but until then i'd just leave them be and not invite them to any of the cool parties till they get the message.

Iraq i'm not too worried about, Sadam knows any attempt by himself to upset the peace will result in serious bodily harm. What does worry me are indirect terrorist attacks by his cronies using his funding and weaponry on targets outside of the country. Sadam and his kind need to go, but I don't think a war is the way to do it. It needs to come from his own people.

Seahorse · Post by **Seahorse** » Fri Jan 03, 2003 3:30 pm

Who are starving, ill educated, terrorised by secret police and fed endless propaganga. Don't hold your breathe for the revolution...